"River Rats" making a comeback!

[Gimpy]

Looks like some of my old compadres I fought along side with in the Delta are proving to very valuable to todays version of the old Mobile Riverene Force.

These guys were some tough hombres!...............


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Navy seeks guidance of Vietnam ''river rats''

By LOUIS HANSEN, The Virginian-Pilot
April 23, 2006


After spending a year on river patrols in Vietnam, Petty Officer 3rd Class Bill Ferguson had a few memorable welcome-back-to-fleet moments.

One happened at the front gate of Portsmouth Naval Shipyard. Ferguson and some fellow sailors drove to meet their new ship, the ammunition hauler Santa Barbara. The Marine guard looked at Ferguson's chest full of ribbons. The men exchanged words.

"No sailor deserves that many medals," the Marine smirked before yanking them off.

The young sailor retorted with his fists.

Ferguson, now living in Hertford, N.C., remembers several other scuffles with authority after returning from combat.

"It was difficult making a transition from having life and death decision-making power," Ferguson said, "to becoming just another snipe down in the hole" aboard a ship.

The so-called "river rats" came back from Vietnam with shaggy hair, green uniforms and rows of decorations. Chain of command they had pushed overboard into the silted waters of the Mekong Delta. In a four-man boat, everyone had to perform.

When the brown-water sailors rejoined the fleet, big Navy sometimes shunned them, they said. Superiors ground away their brashness or pushed them back toward civilian life.

Thirty years later - through marriages, families, careers and memories both bitter and warm - big Navy is calling for the river rats.

The Navy needs them because it's creating a whole new generation of brown-water sailors.

The Navy began rebuilding a riverine force late last year as part of a new, 40,000-troop command dedicated to sailors-on-the-ground combat and support. The riverine force comprises a small piece of the Navy Expeditionary Combat Command, about 900 sailors in three squadrons based at Little Creek Naval Amphibious Base.

The force plans to deploy to Iraq next year, replacing a Marine unit on the Euphrates River.

It initially will be just a sliver of the Vietnam-era brown-water fleet at its peak. But leaders in the new command quickly reached out to the old river veterans - scattered when the Navy dismantled their unit in the early 1970s.

The Navy began calling in the brown-water sailors, from petty officers to admirals, last fall. Capt. Michael Jordan, commodore of Riverine Group One, said the veterans have offered valuable advice.

The new sailors boarding small, fast boats in foreign waters have no combat experience to draw from. The veterans have been eager to help.

The command hopes to keep the veterans group together to continue to informally advise on new training, tactics and systems, Jordan said.

Jim Reckner, director of the Vietnam Center at Texas Tech University, said that during Vietnam the men on warships served a world away from the small-boat sailors. The close camaraderie formed on the small boats stuck with the men, and their combat experience set them apart in the fleet.

"We'd been there," said Reckner, a riverine veteran. "They hadn't."

Larry Weatherall ran more than 200 patrol missions in Vietnam as an engineman and gunner. His crew fought dozens of battles under the triple canopies of the jungle, squeezing 30-foot, fiberglass-hulled craft along tight rivers and canals.

With the riverine patrol boats clipping along at 25 knots, he had a couple of things to hold on to: the grips on his 50 caliber machine gun and faith in his boat mates.

"You could control some things," Weatherall said, "but some things controlled you."

Weatherall, who lives in Virginia Beach, rose from seaman to petty officer second class on the river. A copy of his service record tucked in a scrapbook declares : "Extremely effective and reliable. Works well on his own."

After the war, though, he left the Navy.

The fleet held a tight structure on its sailors. Weatherall wanted to get on with life, find a job back in his small California hometown.

He felt he had made a relatively smooth transition back into civilian life. "A lot of guys had it a lot worse," he said.

He quickly volunteered to share his experience with the new command.

In some ways, the two generations can be considered shipmates, Weatherall said.

"We can offer lessons learned," Weatherall said.

Ferguson fought through his Navy career. He came to the brown-water force from an aircraft carrier, where he ran afoul of a superior .

Searching to prove himself again as a worthy sailor, he volunteered for brown-water duty. He soon became a boat captain.

His patrol boat engaged in about two dozen fire fights, he said. Ferguson and his boat mates collected several medals for valor. He remembers bringing a "snotty" attitude back to the fleet.

"I was used to getting my own way. I was used to doing what I wanted to do," he recalled. "Big Navy doesn't like that."

Ferguson said he slowly figured out that he fought and drank too much. He gave up alcohol and found a command he could comfortably work with: special forces at Little Creek. The SEAL boat drivers are direct descenda nts of the brown-water boat handlers.

Ferguson also has shared his experiences on training and building boat crews. "It's wonderful," he said.

Ken Meek, a retired Navy captain living in Norfolk, said his river experience also changed him. He supervised a force of 90 patrol boats and advised the South Vietnamese river force as a commander in 1967.

The brown- and blue-water sailors had more similarities than differences, Meek said. C ombat experience made the brown-water men more intense, though.

"They had to be willing to step up, take charge and confront the unknown," Meek said.

Soon after the war, the river veterans began to form their own fraternal organizations.

The Gamewardens of Vietnam was formed in August 1970 by returning members of the Navy's Task Force 116. The Mobile Riverine Force Association also holds regular reunions.

With the rise of the Internet and a growing nostalgia, veterans say it has been easier to stay in closer touch with their comrades.

Weatherall said he got together with his Navy friends every year or two for beers. He works for Ford and is president of the regional chapter of the Gamewardens.

Word of the graybeard conferences with the Navy burned up the Internet. Veterans groups sent delegations to meet active-duty leaders in Annapolis earlier this month.

Weatherall jumped at the chance.

At Annapolis, the men shared their insight on training and tactics. Some were disappointed to learn that the young force did not yet have dedicated air support or a fully defined mission.

But dozens of veterans offered their support, advice and war stories.

During a break at the conference, Weatherall and the other veterans crowded along the pier side to look at the new fast boats. Marines and special operations troops showed off the sleek camouflaged vessels.

Weatherall gazed over the twin-engine 30-foot craft, painted to match a jungle environment.

"What a fantastic boat," he thought.

He wouldn't let himself climb aboard.

"We have to be careful about pushing ourselves on them," he said. "We'll help in any way we can."

Ferguson did not make the trip. He attends reunions and e-mails his fellow river rats from his new home in North Carolina.

Ferguson, now a retired senior chief, lives in a river front home.

# Reach Louis Hansen at (757) 446-2322 or louis.hansen@pilotonline.com .

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[exlrrp]

""No sailor deserves that many medals," the Marine smirked before yanking them off.

The young sailor retorted with his fists."

Well this is a very interesting anecdote, makes you wonder what happened to the Marine. Did he have thje right to rip off the medals and was he punished for this? Was ferguson punished for punching a Marine MP?
'Minds me of the time I was in Ft Lewis going through the line to Vietnam and one of ther people behind the counter wanted my pregnant Seahorse Patch. This was the 3d/508th patch from Panama, whicch looked like the 82s patch but instead of the AA had a dragon in it. They had a collection of patches on the wall behind the counter
He tried to rip it off!! I shoved him back--whio the fuck are you to take my patch?? Then the NCO came over--he started giving me shit too. I demanded to see an MP and the commanding officer!! they can't strip you of your personal property!! (oh yeah??) I PAID for that patch and since I was going to Vietnam prepared to die I wasn't taking any shit from REMFs. They let me walk away with the patch but only after I told them I was going to the IG and the MPs right after that to complain.
Anybody who thinks there's freedom of speech in the military will not want to review THAT conversation!! You don't even have the right to private property according to them!!
F**K the sorry C**cksuckers that will steal the patch right off your shirt WHILE YOURE WEARING IT!! And on the way to Vietnam too. The supply people later stole everything I had While I was in the 101st also, whil e they had our stuff stashed for "security". Nobody there had the troop's back, not at all.
Stay good, Steve, looking forward to meeting you in a few days

James

Always thought you could wear combat badges/patches with the duty uniform but they wouldn't let me wear my CMB on mine (hospital whites).

That marine sure in heck deserved what he got. You don't disrespect anyone elese like that. Exlrpp I agree with you 100% about the supply folks, especially when we got our supplie, you could always find that the best brand of cigaretts were gone, and the good candy bars missing, we were left with the chesterfields, the pall malls, and the camels. The Marlboros, Kools and Salems were alway gone. Used to piss me off.

[1CAVCCO15MED]

I never got an x-ray supply that wasn't stolen. And I went to high school with the supply officer!

[lcpd24]

Thanks Gimpy for saying what I've been trying to get out for over 30+ years, makes me feel damned good, an proud that I was a salior on the rivers

[onesix]

Any of you yahoo's out of Sa Dec? On a PBR? With HAL(3)?

Question: We Army types called our medical patrols MEDCAPS. The Navy had slightly different terminology. Been trying to remember it but for the life of me can't pull it out of my military mind.

BTW, as an Army advisor in the Delta, I couldn't get squat for support out of our province HQ. Had to depend on the Navy, including the best little whorehouse in the Delta (Sa Dec). Much obliged.

[exlrrp]

Originally posted by Robert J Ryan That marine sure in heck deserved what he got. You don't disrespect anyone elese like that. Exlrpp I agree with you 100% about the supply folks, especially when we got our supplie, you could always find that the best brand of cigaretts were gone, and the good candy bars missing, we were left with the chesterfields, the pall malls, and the camels. The Marlboros, Kools and Salems were alway gone. Used to piss me off.

RJR
I have to say the 4th Div got about as fcked over as ever I saw a division, plus got more than their share of combat but that may be because I only had them to study closely, other than the 101st which got fcked over even more and aslso saw combat. It was a close thing.
But I fooled them all, hardeharhar, I SMOKED chesterfields pall malls and camels out of choice!
I remember in the 101st we'd get one sundry pack per platoon on resupply, this was far below the minimum even for understrangth platoons and a case of C's apiece..
And out of 10 cartons of cigs, two of them wold be chesterfield Kings and one pall mall, which I would take with a smile while everyone else fought over the Winstons and Marlboros. Later, when they had run out, I'd trade packs of C's and M's for peaches and poundcake. I don't remember anyone smoking menthol, we'd save those to trade with the Vietnamese.
I live not far away from Salem OR, I still think of it as Sahlem.
Stay good
James